tv Your Money CNN November 3, 2012 10:00am-11:00am PDT
subway system. coming up later on today at 2:00 eastern, larry king will break down the third party effect on the election. "your money" starts right now. hello, everyone. welcome to a special live edition of "your money." i'm coming you to live from columb columbus, ohio. in three days, this is the state that will likely decide the presidential election. governor romney knows that only too well that no republican has won the white house without winning ohio and the race right now in ohio is close to a dead heat. let's look at the two latest polls. first, our own cnn/orc poll of likely voters shows president obama with a three point lead. now that is inside the statistical margin of error. so that's about as close as it can get. and nbc "wall street journal" poll gives the president a six point lead in ohio. a little better for obama. still very close. now obama may be the top prize
for the candidates right now l are other important battleground states. we'll take through over the course of the next hour in a way that only cnn can. john avalon and i traveled more than 1800 miles on cnn's battleground bus tour as the race for the white house reaches its conclusion. no mat wrer i ter where i go, t economy is the most important issue in this election. i've been traveling with john avalon. he joins me now as does my good friend christine romans. she joins me from washington. jim acosta from did he back to you, iowa, where mitt romney just landed. brianna keeler is in milwaukee, wisconsin, traveling with president obama. let's start here in ohio. the state has a very complex economy. here's some of what we've been hearing from voters on this trip. >> just a lot of depressed areas. a lot of joblessness. >> just looking at the unemployment rate, it's so scary to me. >> the last four years has not
been very good for our small business. >> with the debt crisis, our country has, that burden is going to be on us in the future. >> all of the skills i had are obsolete now. >> i'm not up at the white house. i don't see rich people all the time. i see a lot of poor people. >> shut down, closed, reduced wages, ship the jobs overseas. we lost 55,000 factories. >> we're probably never have the things that we did 30, 40 years ago. >> balance the budget. we keep spending more and more. somewhere along the line it's going to come back and haunt us. >> they didn't plan for us. now we have to clean up the mess that they made. >> john avalon joins me now. we have been on that bus from florida through north carolina, through virginia, through and into ohio. the economy is number one concern. once you get into ohio, you're touching a lot of the concerns. in the eastern side of the state where we were, natural gas was an issue. they have fracking.
but now this auto and manufacturing stuff is playing. mitt romney ran this ad about the auto companies taking bailout money. manufacturing in china not working for them so well. >> not working for them. we were in toledo last night. talking to people on the street, they this taken offense from that ad. that's where that jeep plant is. folks have been calling jeep and saying is it true? i heard this ad. is my job in danger? not true. executives from chrysler and gm came down hard on the romney campaign for it, calling it the most cynical kind of campaign politics n that area and every area here matters, you can tell that particular campaign gamut backfired. >> but mitt romney is still kpetive in ohio. >> this is a mainstream republican state. there is a reason no republicans won the white house not winning ohio. there is a deep republican tradition in this state. the fact that it's an obama fire wall is what is remarkable. this is a state that mitt romney could do well. he should do well. running the obama's campaign core strategy appealing to middle class voters, working
class whites in this state makes a big difference when it comes to ground game and that critical early voting. mitt romney has had a real problem connecting to those folks. >> who is he leading with in ohio? >> president obama is leading with women. he's leading with centrist business 0 points. losing independents by two points. losing white men by a considerable margin. leading with folks who make undered 50 e$50,000 a year. so the national themes are evident here in ohio. >> when you say independents and centrists, you're describing them as two separate things. a lot of viewers think independents means centrists. >> in the past, they have. one of the fascinating things about this election, the impact of the tea party on independent voters, it moved them to the right. so you see independents edging toward mitt romney. president obama has had a decided edge among moderates. fascinating new division in the electorate that we're seeing playing out. >> stay here. we'll talk more about this. brianna keeler is in milwaukee. the president will be there later today. three days out. this is the final chance for the president to make his case to
voters. what's the final message going to be? >> reporter: he's countering, ali, mitt romney's message where he is talking about being the candidate of real change. we've been hearing president obama say that's not true. president obama saying that he is the candidate of change, admitting that the change has been slow going as far as improvement to the economy. but still urging voters to have patience with him. remember, yesterday with those jobs numbers out, he pointed to private sector gains, trying to show that things are heading in the right direction. the other thing, he's trying to say to voters you know me. you may not agree with me all of the time. but you know i am a man of my word. and that you know what you're going to get. obviously, the insinuation being that with mitt romney, voters don't. and then the other thing, this is very important especially here in wisconsin, especially where you are in ohio, talking about the auto bailout and how that has affected obviously in
ohio, one of eight jobs tied to the auto industry. here in wisconsin, a lot of jobs ti tied to the auto supply industry. he has an easier time on the economic message. you look at a number of battleground states and this is true in wisconsin and ohio, unemployment here, significantly lower than the national average. 7.3% in wisconsin. 7.0% in ohio where you are. so the auto bailout message seems to be resonating a little more in these places, ali. >> and there are a lot of people, a lot of conservatives and republican supporters in both of the states who say the states have republican governors. so who do you give the credit to for the lower unemployment? the president or the republican governors? stay there. we'll get back to you. jim acosta, three days to go. mitt romney spending time in iowa today, a state with one of the lowest unemployment rates in the country. job creation isn't an issue in iowa. what is the issue? what is it that they're voting
on? >> reporter: well, ali, i think iowa is a part of a battleground strategy. if you can't win ohio and talking about that just a few moments ago with brianna and john avalon, then you need iowa. then you need wisconsin. then you might need pennsylvania which explains why mitt romney is heading there tomorrow. getting back to the auto bailout issue, tikd a top republican source last night at this event in southern ohio where they were kicking off the swing state blitz with the different surrogates for the gop nominee, they feel like they have been working hard to mitigate that issue, pointing out that, you know, while, yes, mitt romney did oppose the auto bailout, he would have supported financing for those companies coming out of bankruptcy. you know, obviously there is this question of whether or not those companies would have been intact coming out of bankruptcy. and even being in a position where fellow financing would have helped at that point. but they have been trying to point out and ads are very controversial, no doubt about it, that while these companies have been bailed out, they have
been creating jobs in china. i talked to this one republican source who said why aren't the jeeps, why aren't the cars being made in ohio and then sold over in china? that is the message that they've been trying to say with respect to that issue. when it comes to pennsylvania, they look at pennsylvania and say, hey, you know, there are some of the same demographic advantages for mitt romney in that state. you get outside of the urban areas like philadelphia and pittsburgh, you have a huge chunk of pennsylvania in the middle. full of rural voters. you don't have the baggage of the auto bailout. so that is partly the reason why they're looking at pennsylvania in the hopes that if ohio doesn't work, pennsylvania might. >> i was going to ask you about pennsylvania. that was a bit of a surprise that republicans are taking another turn back into there. does come down to philadelphia and pittsburgh which send to be overwhelmingly blue. very interesting that romney campaign has taken a turn there. latest polling shows president obama up four points.
jim, stay where you are. we'll get back to you. christine, i want to ask you about something jim said. it is such a hot button in this state, this idea that american companies are making vehicles in china. why don't they just make them in america and ship them over? this shows a fundamental misunderstanding of the entire auto industry. for decades and decades and decades american auto companies have made cars in the countries or the regions in which they sell them. i want to remind americans, when they buy toy oat yaz and hond yaz and hyundais and they buy nissans in america that are assembled here, back home somebody says why you shipping our jobs to america? so it really shows a fundamental, fundamental misunderstanding by romney camp to try and get under people's nails about jobs. they may make jeeps in china for the chinese audience. general motors does the same thing. this is not news. >> this shows you, ali, that auto making and making things is in the dna of modern america.
it also shows that you if you can make a message, spin a web ad based on the fears of manufacturing and auto manufacturing in particular, it resonates in america. it's what we defined ourselves by for, you know, since world war ii. it's a message that clearly the romney campaign thinks is going to work for them. otherwise, they wonlts uldn't b doing it. this whole idea about detroit and the bailout, this is -- this has been something that has been torturous for both campaigns from the very beginning. and it's not something that anybody wanted. remember, the financial crisis happened -- the financial crisis happened and the auto bailout happened, you know, started by president bush and pushed and followed through by president obama. this is something that funneledmefunnele fundamentally bothers a lot of people. the american auto industry almost went out of business. that's something that really plays in these ads. that's why they're doing it. >> christine, we're going to speak to chris ratner.
he says that mitt romney is simply not telling the truth. the language that steve ratner uses is a lot nicer than the language i've been hearing in ohio about those ads. this is not helping mitt romney in this state. stay where you are. i'm coming back to you as well. president obama is trying to save his job but has he done enough to save yours? that's the big question with the jobs report that just came out. we'll be right back with a special live edition of "your money" from ohio. there are a lot of warning lights and sounds vying for your attention. so we invented a warning you can feel. introducing the all-new cadillac xts. available with a patented safety alert seat. when there's danger you might not see, you're warned by a pulse in the seat. it's technology you won't find in a mercedes e-class. the all-new cadillac xts has arrived, and it's bringing the future forward.
there is no doubt that friday's jobs report is positive. that doesn't mean that it's the best thing you've ever seen. it doesn't mean that 171,000 jobs that were added in october was the right number. it is not negative. they need to convince voters that they can create jobs. it's not enough. so which one is going to do better? >> companies hired more workers in october than at any time in the last eight months. >> unemployment is higher today than when barack obama took office. >> all right. if voters believe job creation is moving in the right direction, president obama could win. if they believe that it's not improving fast enough, mitt romney could win. i want to bring christine romans back in with a look at the final jobs report before tuesday's election. christine, you have done everyone a real service by
breaking this down and showing people what this means. i have said for ten years, please be careful with that unemployment number. it doesn't tell you the full story. sometimes it goes down whether people lose jobs. sometimes it goes up when people gain jobs which is it what happened on friday. please, christine, please do what you do and let our viewers understand why the none sensens utterly nonsense. i don't think we should have a 7.9% unemployment rate. there is so much misinformation out there. >> before i give you the numbers, you can have an unemployment rate tick up to 7.9% and that can be guy thing. th -- be a good thing. that means people are looking around saying, hey, i know somebody who got a job. i'm going to try again, too. so that can be what happens. many economists are telling me that's probably what happened in the month of october. we know the economy added 171,000 jobs in october. bureau of labor statistics revised numbers also for august and september.
that adds another 84,000 jobs. that means the economy has added 194,000 jobs net-net since the president took office. that number may be higher once you get preliminary revisions and they're made final early next year. the bls estimate that's it undercounted jobs in 2011 by 389,000. that means the economy added more than half a million jobs since the president took office. you won't hear the romney campaign talking about that. they're focused on that unemployment rate. it stood at 7.8% in september. the same when the president took office. it ticked up to that 7.9% in october. high unemployment is never a good sign. americans don't have jobs need to be in the labor force actively looking for work to be count the as unemployed. size of the labor force increased by 578,000 in october. that's a sign that the economy is improving enough, ali, for americans to start looking for work.
>> please tweet out how the unemployment rate is infecting the economy. this is really important. these are two surveys. there is the household survey and establishment survey. there is the unemployment rate, percentage. the establishment survey is the number of jobs created. everybody needs to hear that. so thank you, christine. stay there. i want to bring in harvard economistist ken rogoff from the international monetary fund. one of the world's leading authorities on financial crisis. ken, let's now put aside the conspiracy theories and the nonsense about whether it's good or bat. we know it is positive. but, it's not enough. but 171,000 is pochsitive.
can you call this a recovery? it's still going to take you years and years to get back to normal. so this was a good month as christine said not just because of the jobs that were recorded for october, but revisions saying, hey, there were mob jobs in t -- more jobs in the last couple months. i think both candidates, i hope whoever wins is going to show us something better over the next four years. but it is not easy after a financial crisis like this. i don't think it's going to be possible to get galluping growth quickly. >> ken, let me ask you this. the reason i picked that 250,000 number, different economists say different things. both campaigns, the romney campaign says it a lot. the obama campaign agrees, say they can create 12 million jobs if four years. that's three million a year. that is 250,000 jbz a month. 80,000 more than we're seeing.
they both assume, by my calculations, they assume a 4% gdp growth. we're at 2%. now increasingly, surrogates from both campaigns have told me they can do it with a 3% gdp rate which is what we might actually see next year. now former congressman, you know him, vin webber says fiscal and government restraint is the key. listen to what he said. >> we're not seeing any element of that from this administration. no fiscal restraint. only higher taxes on capital as well as on labor. that's a bad mix. >> so that's the answer that the republicans are putting forward. fiscal and government restraint will kick up your gdp growth to the extent you'll create more jobs. ken, do you buy that? >> well, i -- looks to me like their plan is to cut taxes. you hope you get really fast growth. i think the deficit would go up a lot for a while. we would get growth. but i'm not sure it would be anything like we saw under
reagan. there is so much debt out there. there is so many headwinds. there's europe, the a administration would do less on cutting taxes if at all and probably raise spending. that's really where the difference is between the two. one of them wants a smaller government. one of them sees the government doing more things. that's a big difference. >> you know more than i do. quick answer, do you think either of them will get the 12 million jobs in four years that they're promising? >> it would be a very good outcome. i think it's a long shot, frankly. >> your answer is smarter than mine. i said i'd wear a dress for a week if it happened. you're in less danger. thanks very much for being with us. let's get back to ohio. let's get back to the auto bailout. president obama bailed out the auto industry. mitt romney says the bailed out auto companies are using that money to ship jobs to china. we'll get to the bottom of what really happened with the auto bailout next on a special live edition of "your money" from ohio. [ male announcer ] you are a business pro.
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we're live in ohio, a state where manufacturing is key. a big portion of that manufacturing is autos. one in eight jobs in ohio connected to the auto industry. i want to drill down on something i spoke to christine about earlier. there are 76,000 people in ohio employed in auto and auto parts manufacturing. only michigan has more. but that number would be much smaller if the u.s. government hadn't bailed out the automakers. let me say that again. the number would be much smaller if they hadn't bailed out the automakers. the center for automotive
research found that between 2009 and 2010, the bailout saved 1.5 million jobs across the u.s., save $$100 billion in personal kmk and saved the government $29 billion in what would have been lost revenue. it did still cost the government money though. here's why it matters. both presidential candidates spent millions of dollars campaigning in this state. president obama leads mitt romney, barely in, a race this tight the auto bailout could swing the vote. now survey conducted by ohio newspaper organization finds that 29% of likely voters are more likely to vote for obama because of the auto bailout. that's compared to 21% who say they are less likely to vote for him as a result. mitt romney tried to cut into the president's support with this ad. >> obama took gm and chrysler into bankruptcy. and sold chrysler to italians who are going to build jeeps in china. mitt romney will fight for every american job. >> now there seemed to have been
some calculation that the romney campaign made that they would somehow benefit from this ad, that jeep was taking jobs from the united states, moving them to china to build jeeps there. chrysler's ceo says it's simply not true. he writes on the company's blog, "jeep production will not be moved from the united states to china. jeep assembly lines will remain in operation in the united states and will constitute the backbone of the brand. it sin accurate to suggest anything different." the man who president obama pictured to the czar to save the auto industry is stephen ratner. i asked for a response. stephen, good to see you. how do you respond to this ad? i'm here in ohio where these jeeps are made. they said that what mitt romney has said is wrong. tell me what you know about this. >> i think chrysler and general motors actually responded more forcefully than i have ever seen a company respond in 30 years in the business in terms of the
adamancy they expressed. the facts are what he said. it makes good business sense for jeep to begin to produce jeeps in china for the local chinese market. those are jeeps that are not going to really get -- could not be realistically exported from the u.s. they need to be built close to the home market, just like every other automaker does. general motors has huge operations in china, ford does, theation companies, german companies. it's good business sense. so there are no jobs being moved. >> all right. the nonpartisan congressional budget office says the auto bailout, while it has given the government some money because of tax revenues it didn't lose, will end up costing taxpayers $20 billion compared to the $18 billion profit that came out of the banking bailout. is there a chance that taxpayers could get their money back from this auto bailout? >> there is a chance. it's unlikely. and i and the president and larry summers and tim geithner were clear from the beginning with the american people through
the press that we did not expect to get all the money back. first, there was $17 billion that went into general motors and chrysler tend of 2008 as bridge loans. companies were not prepared to go through the restructuring that we undertook. that money will never come back. so that's most of the amount that you just cited. the point i would make is that if at the end of the day the american taxpayer losesed adds billion, $10 billion, even $20 billion on this auto rescue and save the 1.4 million jobs you referred to earlier, that's a very good trade for the american taxpayer. that's what government is here to do. to use its resources, prudently, carefully, surgically to achieve a great benefit. >> now a lot of americans still disapprove, though, about just 44% of americans actually approve of the auto bailout. that is according to a gallup poll. if we saved a lot of jobs, why is it that so many americans, do you think, are unconvinced this was the right thing to do and that it was a waste of money?
>> actually, ali, when the president made those decisions, the percentage of americans who approved it was down in the 20s. i think some polls were even lower. look, i get the fact that the american public hates bailouts. i hate bailouts. but what i think the people who not yet -- who have not yet come onboard don't fully appreciate is the enormous economic devastation that would have occurred largely in michigan and ohio and midwest and across the country as those 1.4 million jobs disappear. so i think the public has come a long way in terms of appreciating this. we'll see on tuesday whether the voters of ohio appreciate what was done. >> it's unusual but this is one of those things where both president obama and mitt romney say absolutely opposite things. president obama says that mitt romney was not prepared to do or did not support what president obama did with you. mitt romney says that you guys did largely what he was suggesting you do. what the auto industry. tell me what your perspective is on this. >> the basic fundamental difference between the two is that mitt romney says he would
have not used any federal money to help these companies except possibly on their way out of bankruptcy. the problem with that approach is that there would have been no out of bankruptcy. they never would have left bankruptcy. these companies had no cash. they could not afford to pay their suppliers. they could not afford to pay the workers. they could not afford to keep their lights on. if we had not provided the money we provided in the spring of 2009 before they went in bankruptcy and during the bankruptcy, they would have never come out of bankruptcy. >> all right. stephen ratner, you would know. you were the auto czar. you were involved in it. good to see you again, stephen. thank you. >> thank you, ali. with three days to go before election day, the battle for the battleground states, like ohio, is raging. we'll check in with our reporters across the country right after this. your watching a live edition of "your money" from ohio. rogaine? well, i'll admit it.
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you're watching ann romney. that is did iowa. mitt romney just landed there. they came off a plen and ann romney is speaking at the podium. we're going to drop into that in just a moment when mitt romney starts speaking. in the meantime, we'll keep a very close eye on that. i want to bring you back to iowa for a moment. that's where i am right now. iowa -- i'm sorry, ohio. that's where i am. ohio made decide this election along with a handful of other swing states. cnn has reporters across the country in the key battleground states. poppy harlow is in ohio. john zor he will yoe is in florida. let me show you how different these states are when it comes to jobs which is the most important of the economic issues. as you know, the economy is the most important issue out here. let's look at nevada. it has the highest unemployment rate of the so-called tossup states. 11.8%. colorado's much closer to the national average. it's at 8%. the national average is 7.9%.
here in iowa, it's lower. florida, much higher, 8.7%. but iowa has one of the lowest jobless rates in the country. it has for some time, 5.2%. they actually have a problem finding workers. let's go back to iowa where mitt romney is speaking. >> i know most of you here have decided who you're voting for in three more days. but you have some neighbors who haven't made up their minds yet. and so i want to make sure that i give you all the arguments you need to make sure that you convince some of them to come vote for our team. paw rye paul ryan and i want to bring real change to america. so some folks are putting aside the demands of daily life and focusing on this campaign. they want to know what the future is going to hold depending on who becomes the next president. who's going to affect their life and their family's life and who is going to affect the country in the way it will make the
greatest difference. you can remind them that words are cheap. you can say whatever you want to say in a campaign. but what you can achieve, results, those are earned. those can't be faked. you see, four years ago you could remind them that candidate obama made a number of promises. then go and look at the promises and say how did they do on those? he was going to be a post partisan president. he's been most partisan in dividing -- >> we'll keep an eye on mitt romney's speech in iowa. poppy, that seems like guy problem to have. in des moines and other parts of iowa, the unemployment rate is very low. they can't find workers. but that's also not ideal for them. >> reporter: right. no, it's not. in fact, ali, this is the front page of the "des moines register." iowa's shrinking jobless race is misleading. one of the business owners i spoke with during my week here
said i can't find the right people to fill the jobs. but those top line numbers here are good for the president, 5.2% unemployment. housing prices that all but surpassed this state as strong farming sector. the people here really care about one big picture thing, ali. that's the deficit. they hate the government's spending. and they're looking at the future. what's ahead for their kids? one of the guys i talked to here in iowa that really sums it up is chad moran. take a listen to him. >> fiscally, i just don't see how we can sustain ourselves. i mean europe right now, these big, huge great empires, countries and all that, they're going bankrupt. and it's going to be us. >> reporter: he is one that is in line with that, line that we hear from romney that we're on a path to greece. we both think that is a bit deceiving. does he think that our future is in question when it comes to spending. we'll tell you the jobs issue here is also lower paying jobs, more part time work than
full-time work people tell me here. they're having a hard time even though that 5.2% looks better than the rest of the country. >> yet another reason why the percentage unemployment rate never tells the full story. it looks great in iowa. but there are still lots of issues. i'm hearing the same thing in ohio, by the way, people who while jobs are their main issue, they're concerned about the deficit. they're also concerned about the quality of jobs and the wages they get and benefits. thanks very much for that. john zorella is surrounded by long lines of early voters. we were in florida earlier on this battleground state. housing a big issue. the value of housing. what you are hearing? what is the big issue that you're hearing from voters there? >> reporter: you know, ali, it's funny. you were mentioning the big lines. it's about a two hour wait right now from where i'm standing. it was four hours earlier this morning. so a lot of people exercising their right on the last day of early voting.
i was chatting with some of the people here. as you mentioned, jobs is a big issue for everyone. health care has come up and many people saying off the bat, big issue for them. and women's rights. those are the three things i heard the most from all the people here. the jobs, health care, and women's rights from the people i just talk with in line. you mentioned housing. that's huge. all of the foreclosures in the state, particularly in the single family housing industry, that has been hit very, very hard. so many foreclosed existing properties out there hard to get much construction going in that sector. you know, just a couple hours up the road from here at kennedy space center, yesterday retired the last of the three space shuttles, atlantis, putting an end to the space shuttle program. it is over. at united space alliance alone, 4,000 skilled workers laid off. so the aerospace industry, the space industry very hard hit. and so jobs there are very critical. and, of course, overall in the
state the whole construction industry that has not recovered at all. ali? >> right. we're seeing pockets of recovery in florida. pockets of home price increases. still, a long way to go. john, thank you very much. busy day for mitt romney. the last event of the day will be in engelwood, colorado tonight. and that's where cnn's reporter is. what is -- what you are hearing? what matters most to folks in colorado and what's romney's plan to win them over? >> reporter: governor romney is going to stop here and speaking at that theater behind me a little later today. and he is going to make the case, he's been making over the last two weeks, it is about jobs. now set person who is going to make jobs more secure over the next four years. and he's got a dwind ling numbe of people would will listen to him. in this state, 1.6 million people have already voted. now they are expecting by
tuesday 85% of the voters will have already voted. romney's case now is to try to energize the people who are left. it is the number one issue here. it is all about jobs. ali? >> thanks very much. we'll be checking in with you later in the day as mitt romney heads to colorado. now the u.s., the u.s. is headed back into a recession at the end of the year. if leaders in washington don't act. neither candidate has a plan to fix the thing that is most serious right now. neither politician wants to tell us what it is if they had one. we'll tell you more after that the break. and i honestly didn't think i would ever quit. [ male announcer ] along with support, chantix is proven to help people quit smoking. it reduces the urge to smoke. it put me at ease that you could smoke on the first week. [ male announcer ] some people had changes in behavior, thinking or mood, hostility, agitation, depressed mood and suicidal thoughts or actions while taking or after stopping chantix. if you notice any of these stop taking chantix and call your doctor right away. tell your doctor about any history of depression or other mental health problems,
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well, it's the largest problem that next president will face and neither candidate is saying anything about the fiscal cliff. that combination of $7 trillion in tax hikes and spedding cuts that is set to hit at the end of the year starting at the end of the year. their prescription is a debt reduction -- a number of ceos, more than 80 ceos have gotten together and called for a debt reduction plan that roughly follows the simpson bowls plan that reduces spending, increases tax revenues. they backed the bipartisan plan as a framework or a starting point for negotiations. norm ornstein is from the american enterprise institute. he's the co-author of the book "even worse than it looks." norm, we talked about this last week. we know you held the tea party
responsible for standing in the way of any plan that president obama put forward. so would a mitt romney win break up that deadlock and represent a new republican party that could actually get things done? >> reporter: you know, ali, i was bemousused by the products "the new york times" which blamed the house republicans for -- >> all right. i don't hear him. i'm going to check with my control room if we got norm with us. >> i'm here. >> all right. i don't hear anybody. >> oops. >> all right. we're going to -- i'm going to have to stop you for a second and take a quick break because we do not -- i lost your audio out there. so we are going to -- stay with us. you have a live edition of "your money" here in columbus, ohio. we'll get this fixed up and be back to new a second with bob
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sorry about that. we had a bit of a technical problem. i'm in columbus, ohio. the final stop of the cnn election express battleground bus tour. norm ornstein is standing by. you have seen my frustration for this 2,000 miles where the presidential candidates are not talking about barack obama mentioned it in the last debate, very serious problem. what's the best prescription for getting this solved? who is going to do it? barack obama or mitt romney? >> this is one of the key debates. mitt romney has pivoted back to the center, saying i'm going to bring bipartisanship back. obama said the republicans haven't been working with me. if i'm re-elecre-elected, they' forced to. >> why will they be forced to? >> they embraced the strategy of obstruction, and filibusters in
an unprecedented amount, and it has worked to some extent, except when it comes to solving problems. what a lot of political scientists believe is if obama is reelected, the status quo would kraekt an urgency to not take the country over the fiscal cliff. if one party gets a big idealogical victory, they'll want to go over the cliff and see if they can roll in the new year. here's what's important. we talked to all of the swing voters. you get the frustration about the hyperpartisanship, the division, and real frustration about the deficit and debt. can we get a balanced bipartisan plan? that's going to require both sides to give. that sense of being able to give a little bit has been missing. >> let's talk a little bit about if mitt romney wins, about the fiscal cliff. >> harry reid said the other day he would not work with a president romney if he was elected. that bipartisanship mitt romney
is talking about would not be achieved. in effect, what he would do is what the republicans have done to president obama. every action creates an equal and opposite reaction. that's what promised by the democrats. that cycle of insightment that spirals on. >> i hope it gets solved. we'll talk more about the fiscal cliff and why the politicians aren't talking about it the way we are. we'll talk to smart people about it. "your money" live from ohio. from investing for the first time... to investing with knowledge. the potential of td ameritrade unlocked. nyse euronext. unlocking the world's potential. to a world of super-connected intelligence. the potential of freescale unlocked. nyse euronext. unlocking the world's potential.
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norm ornstein is a resident scholar at the american enterprise institute and the co-altogethco co-author of the book "even worse than it looks." i introduced you and then i couldn't hear you. i thought you were mad. >> i was talking. good, so the question you asked is why are people not talking about the fiscal cliff and what would happen if mitt romney got elected? i was bemoussed by david brooks' logic in a recent column when he
said the house republicans and transigence is a part of this and it wouldn't be different under obama, but under romney, of course, they would go along. and i just think that's false. i think if you have a package like the one being worked out in the senate where you could get 75 senators for it, simpson-bowles type package, 90% of the house republicans have signed on to the glorover norqut no taxes pledge. no way half of them would violate that, so there's no deal under romney. it's more likely to happen, although it's still dicy, under obama. >> and john was sort of saying the same thing. let's bring bob in. a senior lecturer at harvard business school. he also served as the secretary of economic affairs for mitt romney when he was the governor of massachusetts. bob, let's pick this conversation up. if mitt romney wins next week's
election, how is he going to deal with the intransigence that comes from those members of the republican party that did sign grover norquist's pledge to not see taxes raised under any circumstances. even mitt romney, does he reach across the aisle, compromising mitt romney, may not be able to penetrate that. >> there are three key points there. first is whoever is elected president, where believe congress is going over the cliff. there's not enough goodwill on either side to reach an agreement. they'll try but they won't make it. second of all, they will reach a compromise at the end of february because that's when we get to the point when congress has to vote on increasing the debt ceiling. and there are enough congress people who are scared of that vote and will not vote for an increase in the debt ceiling unless there is some fundamental reform. and the third thing is, the key to all economic growth is productivity. that's why i have recently
written a book called "extreme productivity boosts your results." we don't increase that, all of the other stuff is a side show. >> that's an interesting point, bob. you're having a conversation about stuff that is real and matters. we're dealing with a congress that is intransigent largely for political reasons. why do we think congress is going to behave differently? >> i don't think they're going to behave differently until the end of the year because they're not forced to. they can delay the fiscal cliff for two months. they can play some game. but they cannot delay the debt ceiling. if we default at the end of february on our debt ceiling, that's a huge disaster. so that's the forcing issue, and that's what i see the compromise being resolved, whoever is president. >> norm, we have less than a minute left in the show. whoever becomes president while they're busy thinking about the transition if there's a transition or thinking about the inauguration and new term, they have to put their mind to this. does this become headline news
starting the week after the election. >> assuming we have a resolution of the election, but the key here is how the markets react. we hadn't gotten much reaction leading up to the debt limit debacle last time which was generated deliberately by house republican leaders. now that you have the business community involved and they were largely awol the last time we had a crisis, and if we see a substantial market reaction just as we had with t.a.r.p. after house republicans voted it down the first time in 2008, we may get a reaction, but i think bob is right. it may take until getting close to february. >> okay, i hope you guys are right that eventually they will get something done. thanks to both of you. bob pozen and norm ornstein. and norm, i forgive you for not speaking to me earlier. >> there you go. >> listen, that's it for this special live edition of "your money." thank you for joining us. find me on